W800 Free: Katie Ledecky Wraps Up Epic Week With Other-Worldly 8:07.39 WR – Bullseye

EPIC: Katie Ledecky of the United States of America - by Patrick B. Kraemer - [This image was the SwimVortex choice of Photo of the Year 2015, Patrick having captured a bulls-eye snapshot that summed up Ledecky, attitude, achievement and a target reached]

An epic week for Katie Ledecky came to a close on Saturday as the American set a world record of 8:07.39 in the 800 freestyle, in the process completing a sweep of the 200 through 1500 freestyles.

All SwimVortex articles are placed in our archive after five days, the library of content available to subscribers.
Log In Register

Comments

Bad Anon

Off the chart!!!! Sir Craig Lord looking forward to your analysis on this 4.03/4.04 unreal, Hosszu’s 2.06 more normal imo

Ger

I have never see anything like that before; not from Phelps, not anyone. Astonishing.

aswimfan

That was a HUGE swim by Missy Franklin!!!

aswimfan

Canada with a relay medal! nice 🙂

And Russia is OUT.

Karma for Putin?

Bad Anon

Ledecky 7SECONDS faster than Adlingtons beamonesque and SUITED 8.14, simply off the chart?!!!!!!???

aswimfan

As I said before, only a 8:08 or under swim by Ledecky can outdo Hosszu’s 2:06

And this swim did it.

It’s the swim of the meet for me. Which is unreal, considering how unreal 2:06 is

This World championships is the best worlds since probably 2007.

aswimfan

I feel privileged to have watched this 8:07 swim live….

Richard Ortiz

This swim has brought me to tears. Damn, she almost swam 8:06!!!!!!!!!! Never doubt the human will!

easyspeed

Ledecky is a goddess descended from the heavens to swim among mere mortals.

DDias

4:03/4:04?Yikes!

Sorry Craig Lord, but she obliterated Hosszu 2:06 in Medley… that, sir, was the SWIM of THE MEET.

What we will see next year?4:03/4:02?

Los Feliz

@roy I don’t think “China” is one large swimming club. In fact, swimming is not popular in China and we are really talking about a niche market sport in 4, 5 coastal provinces (of about 200 million total population).

I have seen your everyday 9, 10 year old kids from US showing off their skills at pools in China. The swimming experience, knowledge ,and skills in US kids far exceeded the same age group in China. In fact, I tend to believe Sun Yang (and now Ning Zetao) is among the first few true super stars that drove more parents to send their kids to swimming. Wait 10 years or longer till the current gen youngsters enter competition.

Craig Lord

Roy, that’s nonsense: at a glance … more than 50 teenage boys clocked a time inside 8:07 last season alone… and she would have ranked outside the top 120; Ye’s 400IM time would have ranked just outside top 160, all ages. Not that such comparisons work event by event… obv far greater numbers of boys beating girls in the 50 free than there are in the 200 fly and 400IM etc.

Felix Sanchez

Roy,

great as she is, what would be the point? She’s losing over a second a length to those guys.

Craig Lord

It is off the chart, Bad Anon but not off her chart. The same cannot be said for all swims that take us to places where we might not expect to be. 2:06 200IM does not look more normal as a result. I disagree with you. She clocked 8:13 at 15… and has pressed it ever since… she is now 0.35sec or so faster per lap than she was as a 15-year-old… lots of examples of that in the sport.

Felix Sanchez

One of the best things about Ledecky – really adding to her champions mystique anyway – is that we’ve never seen her beaten. Her record in major international competition: 15 events entered, 15 gold medals.

commonwombat

Maybe I’m more measured because, like Craig, my “terms of reference” are probably much longer as regards years of observation than most here. In my case back to the mid-late 70’s.

To my eyes, Ledecky is one of those talents that only come along every 20-30 years …. I can recall Janet Evans re-writing the record books in the late 80’s/early 90’s; Mary T Meagher with butterfly.

In time, someone will come along & re-write Ledecky’s times … that’s the way of things. Comparing them is pointless as suit technologies change as do training regimes/legitimate sports science.

Recognise them and salute them for what they are …. the transcendental athletes of their epoch.

Chris Dolan

Mark Foster on the BBC has said she swims like a man and that was a compliment. Her splits are insane and the last 50m 28.41! She has shown no weakness at these world champs either physically or mentally. 8:07 is Jaw dropping and the performance of the meet by far.

Craig Lord

roy, they said that about Janet Evans and Mary T… it took a while … but they went. You won’t find Juan’s comment, nor yours on the other matter – that is tired and done to death. The comparison doesn’t work on dozens of levels. Enough. Thanks , you too Juan (we’ve been there, done it, many times …)

Craig Lord

I didn’t say it wasn’t the swim of the meet, DDias… it is my choice of swim of the meet …I just don’t agree with relative comparisons of ‘off the chart’.

Ger

A simple and apt summing-up commonwombat, “transcendental.”

Craig Lord

She doesn’t swim like a man, Chris. James Guy swims like a man – and she’s nothing like him 🙂

DDias

I can understand the mistrust and allegations of (possible)PED in Ledecky swim because she is far,far ahead of the field.
But tell her swims aren’t gonna get beaten is silly.There is always a talent out there waiting to be discovered and polished like a diamond.

Ger

It’s not just her swimming. She is very unassuming and humble and her 200 semi showed a lot of guts. Champion qualities. She is a great representative for her sport.

Chris Dolan

Craig you tell that to Mark Foster when you see him! His words not mine, although he is was a sprinter not a long distance swimmer. For me it was better then Hosszu IM because she smashed the record by seconds and I think she can go quicker.

Craig Lord

DDias, not sure I see any allegations – unless you’re making them.
The curve ahead of rest has to be seen in context of event. She’s 9sec faster, or about .5sec a lap faster than a fellow American was 26 years ago. She’s about 0.35 a lap quicker at 18 than she was at 15 and about 0.5sec a lap faster than her closest rival on the clock *bronze today) Jazmin Carlin, who can’t turn to save her life (her words, not mine 🙂 Sarah Sjostrom is 0.67sec fastest than next best all-time in textile, one lap, Ye Shiwen is on average 4sec faster than the rest of the best of the world at the end of a 400IM… context is everything

Chris Dolan

roy perhaps it was a misguided compliment from Foster, Ye Shiwen was not mentioned at all in any context.

easyspeed

Every time you see a woman accomplish something amazing what is sure to follow is some people start making comparisons to men’s performances. I believe this is well intentioned, and meant to be complimentary, but ends up unintentionally disparaging the female athlete’s achievement. Men and women are biologically different, which is why competition is rightly separated. Women swimmers have a slight advantage with the tech suit covering more of the body (yes, even today’s suits produce a tech effect). But men have the much greater advantage of more testosterone, muscle mass, etc. So what is the point of comparing? Why can’t we just appreciate great athletic performances for what they are? Katie is the best women’s freestyler of all time. Thorpe is the best men’s freestyler of all time. Don’t see the need or point of cross gender comparisons.

Bad Anon

Hosszu 2sec faster than Siobhan Marie O’Connor 2.06.12 to 2.08.21(Commonwealth Games); thats 0,5sec faster per 50… Help me understand why a different barometer is used fot Katinka where context is everything

Felix Sanchez

Technique-wise Ledecky swims more like a man, I think was meant.

Ye doesn’t swim like a man: she put in a split that was more like a man’s.

What different observers choose to mention as the context of that split only ever involves a limited subset of possible statistics. The choice is based on the point they want to make.

Felix Sanchez

Sun finished with a 27.34

DDias

Craig Lord,
I am sorry, but I will not buy your “context is everything”.
For your words, a person only dopes if she blasts one leg suspiciously stronger.You are totally underestimating cheaters, like they will be dumb to have a “cheaters pace” in their swimming, like a cheater can’t make a all around(and balanced) race.
If you read some sites besides yours, you will see a lot of naysayers about Ledecky swim.
NOTE:I don’t think Ledecky is a cheat, I just told I understand(but I don’t agree) because her swim is so far,far ahead of the field.

roy,
http://www.omegatiming.com/File/Download?id=00010F020000000402FFFFFFFFFFFF02

Yozhik

Roy, when you are saying that Ledecky is swimming like a man, what do you mean exactly. If it is about time then it is pretty much average on man’s scale. Emotionally? Technically? What is that actually? Looking like a man can be taking as insult if somebody speaks about her body or as flattering if cognitive abilities were mentioned. Are you implying that she genetically not woman. Please be careful when you are making such statements that allow different interpretation.

Felix Sanchez

Paltinieri’s final 50 was 28.15.

In terms of race approach Sun is a probably a better comparison.

Francene Same

I had to sign up because some of the comments are really getting to me.

PED-assisted swimmers are unlikely to be able to be consistent year round (for a variety of reasons). Ye Shewin’s split was “out of character,” something WADA actually considers when investigating. Ledecky, on the other hand, is one of the most consistent top level swimmers of all time (Katinka as well).

I am not accusing anyone at all, but I am saying that Ledecky’s very smooth improvement curves and very consistent performances are extremely telling. Character is likely another.

Francene Same

As far as Ledecky swimming like a man, I believe they mean the technique she uses. Few, if any, other distant swimmers use as much power in their stroke.

Personal Best

Did not watch it live unfortunately, so excuse me if I am completely surprised by her time.
This is some awesome (censored)!

At 18 I guess it is expected of great swimmers to be making such improvements, but the gap on her competitors which she sets is so impressive that it could see her comfortably ahead for a long while.

Good swims by those behind her (Boyle with PB, Ashwood with a PB, Carlin possibly?)

Not taking away from Ledecky’s time, but those behind her are on the slow side of history. For example, that Ashwood only broke 8:20 last year and is only 4 second from the Oz record from 1970 (45 years ago) is impressive for Ashwood but nowhere near the same curve that Ledecky is on.

Swimmer of the meet right here, for me.

Yozhik

Personal Best. the following link will you give all races
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x30w0dd_women-s-800m-freestyle-katie-ledecky-8-07-39-world-record-kazan-2015_sport

easyspeed

Sigh. Here we go again. It is irrelevant how fast a woman’s final 50 is or isn’t compared to a man’s 50; the races were swum at completely different paces. Sun, for example, was fatigued from swimming the first part of his race so much faster. If a woman attempted that pace, she would not be able to match his closing speed. Trying to make such a comparison in order to prove some kind of a point is completely invalid.

easyspeed

I further submit (again) that these sort of discussions are insulting. It is really stupid to say a man swims like a wokan or vice versa. Katie swims like the best woman in the world because she trains harder and produces better times in practice than her other female competitors. Congrats to her for what she has accomplished.

Yozhik

easyspeed. Great words from great man 🙂
What is nice to be a fan of Ledecky that she never disappoints 🙂 But 8:07!!!. Whoever made such prediction I would call a stupid idiot that knows nothing about swimming. Now I can address those words to myself. 🙂

Yozhik

Now I am wondering if 5400 of competitive meters swam at WC races prior this race affect athlete’s abilities. If they do and I believe that it is a very reasonable supposition to make, then what would be her time should she swim only this race like in London.

Felix Sanchez

PB,

Carlin has been 8.15.

easyspeed,

agreed that the ‘swims like a man comment’ was stupid and uninformative. A bit more sympathy for the split comparison, depending on the intention. You’re right, of course, but is that not why people are bringing it up now. Ye’s first 300 was swim down pace for Lochte, but it didn’t stop people comparing their final split. So I take it that once the genie is out of the bottle on that front, someone like roy considers it a defence of Ye to point out another champion doing the same sort of thing (although she didn’t really, as the difference was over a second).

Yozhik

No Roy you are not right. Some people said that Ye swam BETTER then man. Not like a man. 🙂 And this is a big difference. They never said that she swims like Lochte. My wife genially believes that she is better than me and doesn’t think that this is weird. 🙂
That’s why I am repeating my question. What does it mean to swim like a man?

Yozhik

If the answer is that to swim like a man means to be much better than the rest of the filed of best female swimmers then I will except this definition without problems. Not because it comperes women to men but because it is some wording to express the supremacy. I believe that this is ok with you to measure engine power in horse powers. Nobody get insulted, neither engineers nor horses.

Yozhik

Roy you are doing it again. I am positive that you admire Ledecky’s achievements but consistently and probably unconsciously trying to put her “off range for any woman”. From this statement just one small step left to deduce that she is not woman. AND THAT IS WHAT I DON’T LIKE AT ALL.
P.S. I am not saying you are doing this last step. Just asking you be accurate with wording, so people like me will understand you correctly.

Yozhik

The formal definition of record is to be off range. That is why we like sport. We like it for moving ranges. If Ledecky is better than Mark Spitz at any discipline but 200 than it doesn’t qualify her a superMAN. The ranges just got moved.

Personal Best

Thanks Yozhik and Felix.

At the end of a busy week Ledecky looks a little tired but she had room on that WR… quite a bit.

Felix Sanchez

roy, I was just running over the premise of your argument ( as I understood it).
The comparisons and context people choose to use will be to suit a particular purpose: true objectivity is very hard to come by, even when providing facts.

Don’t see any basis for 3.55 or 8.02

Yozhik

I think that Ledecky has better things to do than kicking someone ass 🙂 If Michael didn’t show the improvement at Nationals then I would say that he deserves for being kicked out of the pool for wasting his talent.

Ger

Just curious: On the Omegatiming site, before this final, the championship record is listed at 8:13:25 which is the split for the 1500. Is this correct, can you set an official 800m time during a 1500m race?

Yozhik

Craig, it is not first time when so many people would like to bet their money on swimming race predictions. Why not to make it interesting 🙂 with let’s say 30% going to House. You can add to personal profile PayPal account and keep books.
For those who doesn’t have money to bet a Russian Roulette can be offered. So if some stupid thing was said once there would be no chance to hear for this person again.

All this was a joke guys. Such activities are illegal at least in US. Today we have a very, very exciting races – probably the most interesting day of Championships and I am in the mood to joke around a little bit.

Ger

Phelps just gone 50.45

Yozhik

It is very sad but I have to agree with you Roy on this (records for ever). When Bob Beamon made his famous jump first thing that he heard from Igor Ter-Ovanesyan was that he killed long jump event. That is what Ledecky does to women’s competitive swimming.

gheko

Caaleb Dressel took down two sprint freestyle heavyweights in tonight’s 50-meter free final at USA Nationals. Dressel held on to his top seed by zooming to a 21.53 National Championship finish ahead of Cullen Jones and Josh Schneider. Dressel’s time puts him third in the world this year.

aswimfan

Ger,

Yes, you can officially break 800 records in 1,500 race.
You can even officially break 50.100.300.400 records in 1,500 if you can.

The last swimmer to break 800 WR in 1,500 race was Kieren Perkins when he swam 7:46 WR on his way to 14:41.66 1,500 WR in 1994 commonwealth games.

He was instructed by his coach to break the 800 WR but then to slow down and not attempt to break 1,500 WR to save some energy for 1994 world championships, but he said he felt good so just went away with it.

aswimfan

I kinda sympathize with roy here.

It must be hard to be Shiwen’s fans and keep hearing about doping accusations just because she dared to swim 28, while ledecky who has been doing more monumental swims gets a pass.

I am of position that I give Shiwen benefit of a doubt just as I give Ledecky, Hosszu, Sjostrom and every other swimmers who swam monumental times, as long as they have not tested positive.

But I don’t give a rat’s ass towards swimmers who tested positive and served a ban.

Re Thomas

The only swimmers I hate are those who have tested positive. That means Zetao, Sun Yang, but also Hardy and Efimova. Shiwen is 100% legit. But let’s not pretend Ledecky is without her haters. I’ve seen many insinuate she is a man because of a large forehead.

Yozhik

Re Thomas, whoever said that are probably men who cannot accept the fact that women can be smarter than them and can have forehead larger than their Neanderthal ones.

beachmouse

Also, Kate Ziegler broke the world records in the short course 800 and 1500M at one point in the mid-00s.

aswimfan

Is Ledecky scheduled to swim Moscow and Paris world cup series after Worlds?

I hope she does, as I really want to see what she can do to SCM world records, knowing she has excellent turn and underwater.

Bad Anon

@Aswimfan
The world cup now in lcm in lead up to Olympics to increase qualifying events for Rio. Not sure if entry lists now available though

Ger

TV commentator said Ledecky would be having her wisdom teeth removed next week, so, if that’s accurate, that would rule out Moscow, Paris.

Craig Lord

You don’t need to be sorry DDIas and you can buy what you want – context is indeed everything. You read FAR too much into that; your conclusion and interpretation is ridiculously silly and wholly inaccurate. It is does not represent my views on the issue.
I don’t read the comments in other sites, DDias – really not interested – especially after having noticed some time ago that they are stacked high with libellous material that we would not allow and that professional media organisations such as NY Times, The Times, Washington Post, The Australian and on and on and on do not allow – bound as we all are by pertinent laws in place for good reason and professional standards. This is not a community exercise.

Craig Lord

I read somewhere Ger, some while back, that she was never going to do w cups… World Champs and break is what was planned.

AvantSwim

Congrats on the excellent coverage, Craig and Swimvortex: I appreciate your well-reasoned, fact-based approach to analytics and respect your moderation of libelous comments and trolling.

I particularly appreciate that you generally disallow contributor’s comparisons between swimmers who have ACTUALLY received doping penalties with those who haven’t.

Keep up the vigilance and hard work.

Craig Lord

Thank you, AvantSwim – appreciated by the team here.

ThereaLuigi

Roy, Ledecky and Ye are apples and oranges. Ye swam, just once in a lifetime, a 400 IM which makes no sense at all: 3 legs average, one leg out of this world (this morning Katinka Hosszu, no less, was way ahead of the record line for 300 meters and fell behind like a brick in the water in the last 100). She disappeared since: look at her times this morning, 10 secs behind the first qualifier.

Ledecky has been swimming consistently good in the last 4 years. Lap after lap of every race, and from a race to another. and she is in that age where improvements are expected.

The only thing they have in common is that they are both female swimmers. It really ends there.

aswimfan

“The only thing they have in common is that they are both female swimmers. It really ends there.”

Not true. Both are olympics champions and world championships gold medalists.

ThereaLuigi

I am sure, Aswinfan, you get my point … do you?

aswimfan

ThereaLuigi,

Sorry I really dont…care to enlighten?

ThereaLuigi

First of all, Roy, I didn’t say she doped, I say her case cant be compared to KL’s.
Second, there is the issue of Barcelona 2013, when in the final she was 8 secs slower than the winner and only the shadow of herself the year before. Was there an injury back then, too?
Third, your mentioning swimmers who were injured and did not go to Kazan is counter-productive. If anything, it proves that seriously injured swimmers do not take part in WCs.
Fourth, Bolt has been consistent enough to dominate two Olympics … what are you talking about, “right now”. You don’t get to pick the moment you choose if you are assessing consistency.

ThereaLuigi

No, Aswimfan, I’d rather not.

Francene Same

@roy:

Consistency does matter. And what I mean by that is throughout the year, not just once-or-twice per year every year. I find it irresponsible to get into the science of doping in a forum, but do some research for yourself on it (though it takes a lot of research). And Ledecky is accessible to observe workouts throughout the year so you can observe.

And if you don’t think personal character is also a major indicator of whether someone is doping you are fooling yourself.

I don’t think any of Ledecky’s competitors are questioning whether she dopes.

aswimfan

Sun Yang a no show??????????????????

What the hell happened??

(of course I’m thinking the worst already: he is either failing a test or avoiding a tes)

aswimfan

oopss wrong thread

Yozhik

Roy, why are you putting yourself all the time in such strange position? Being a reasonable man of course you know that consistency matters. Ledecky deserved very well to be named a closer. Her 200 semis and finals cannot illustrated this fact more. Her last 50 at world record races are consistently fast. Very fast though the tremendous efforts and pain. Therefore her yesterday’s 28 doesn’t look surprising at all. Therefore not that many people question her closing time. Just got speechless. I still cannot comprehend this 8:07. It was so unexpected.

Yozhik

Francene Same, I also don’t think that any who shares pool with her are questioning whether she dopes. Instead of trying to find some dirt I advise people to watch how warmly she was congratulated by Lotte Friis. Not many mothers can do it with such care. And look how sincerely responded Ledecky. This should be on the posters.

Yozhik

On the other hand Ledecky’s phenomenon needs explanation. Maybe her body is capable to produce something that can be achieved by drugs only in case of other people. Something makes her swim different form others. I think that she has to donate herself to Science 🙂 It is very possible that the Nature will not create something like she again.

Leave a comment

Post a comment with your SwimVortex Account. Don't have a SwimVortex Account, Sign Up?

(*) Fields are required!
×