Russian Anti-Doping Bosses ‘Offered To Remove Swimmers From Testing Pool’

Russia got to chink glasses with the IOC once more in Rio - but the IPC locked the nation out of the Paralympics, with CAS backing [All images are stills from "Red Herrings" by ARD]
Russia got to chink glasses with the IOC once more in Rio - but the IPC locked the nation out of the Paralympics, with CAS backing [All images are stills from "Red Herrings" by ARD]

As the IAAF prepares to give a thumbs up or down to Russia from the Rio 2016 Olympic Games, the pressure to exclude is set to intensify after two men at the centre of doping revelations in athletics were said to have offered to exempt swimmers from drug-testing in return for an annual fee.

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Comments

aswimfan

What’s even more damaging about Russian doping is that not only it is systematic but also there are elements of individual/private/commercial interests.
It’s like as if you combine Chinese doping of the 90s with US doping of the 2000s.

gheko

There is a lot more going on here than the obvious corruption, stand over men and money!

Barnabas Mandi

As in the communist era. Only the methods, the drugs ang the causes are changed.

aswimfan

The silver lining is that the current Russian government inherited only a small fraction of the discipline, the power, the authority, the efficiency and effectiveness, and the aura of fear of the Soviet Union dictatorial government.

Todays, you can find these whistle blowers eveb inside Russia, which is unthinkable to have happened during the Soviet days.

Yozhik

@Barnabas: somebody is stealing your deep ideas and repeats it word to word on the other site 5 minutes ago.

beachmouse

I guess being able to say ‘at least we didn’t outright take bribes’ let Russian swimming officials sleep at night. It also helps explain why we never heard any follow up when Daria Ustinova was given probation/warning in exchange for naming names- they were probably ordered to drop their investigation by higher ups in Russian sport.

Great harm in the world is often the result of not the charismatic leaders who go down in infamy in the history books but by the bureaucrats who prop him up because they were ‘just doing their job as ordered’.

Yozhik

@asf: I respect your knowledge about history of competition in swimming especially when it goes before 2000 since to find such data is not easy. But when you are talking about Soviet Union era you have no idea what you are talking about. Just because the inside information was not accessible from outside it doesn’t mean that there were not people who understood what is right and what is wrong and didn’t afraid to say that. Why do you think all this came to the end? Leave it alone if you are not sure.

beachmouse

Inside the Games is reporting that the IAAF will continue the suspension of Russian track & field athletes from international competition because adequate anti-doping progress has NOT been made.

God bless German TV documentary makers.

Yozhik

@beachmouse: why is it the “beachmouse”. I would expect like “eagle eye” or something similar. Your views are so wide and observations are so precise – one of the few commenters that worth reading. If calculate the ratio of smart thoughts per words used in comments – you are the champion. I am curious to know who you are in real life.

beachmouse

I started using it as a screen name at another message board I post on and carried it over so I’m the same ‘person’ in a number of places I post. I live not too far from the ocean, and while they are small creatures, the beach mouse populations near me are considered to be endangered species and are legally protected by all kinds of laws.

So this tiny little thing can cause all kinds of chaos on a $20+ million condo development just by existing in their sand dune and requiring the project work around their needs. I like that sometimes such a small thing can have a big impact.

aswimfan

I wished you read my comments carefully once in a while.

I did not say there was no one inside Soviet Union who knew between right or wrong and I didn’t say that there was no one who was not brave enough to tell it like it is. I don’t pretend I know anything about Soviet Union. My comment was limited about whistle blowers against doping in sports especially swimming since this is swimming website and they topic of discussion is about doping.

Since you say I have no idea what I was talking about, can you please enlighten us, a list of whistle blowers inside Soviet Union who told the world that Soviet swimmers were doping?

Yozhik

@asf: Please define your understanding of the word “whistleblower”. It is a new English term for me and I sometimes get confused with its meaning. For example, Edward Snowen is accused of being traitor, but not a whistleblower by usa officials. The whistleblower in my understanding is something respectful that the society likes and something that can be easily ignored with the only consequences to the blower.
Some recent Russian “whistleblowers” as you call them look more to me as people who were denided the deal by Russian officials and “whistle” or “blow” in retaliation.

Yozhik

*Edward Snowden

Craig Lord

Yozhik… I leave asf to answer for himself, of course, but here is what I say: the Stepanovs, for example, have not pleased Russian society, necessarily, but the evidence now tells us that they were informing WADA of the woe going on in Russia long before they could have been perceived to have wanted ‘retaliation’, quite a while before before Stepanova tested positive, for example. Others, too, can be seen as having issued a cry for help. A whistleblower does not require revelations to be seen as ‘respectful’ to all but ‘respectful for what many well see as ‘the right thing’ (society is not one in many of these situations, as we see in what can be perceived as a siege mentality in Russia among those who believe the world against their country and people as a whole, when that is not the case at all)

Craig Lord

E Snowden is perceived as both whistler and traitor, depending on your point of view, of course – and that is how the Stepanovs and others are also being perceived, I’d say

Yozhik

@Craig Lord. If to follow American periodicals or news channels the whistleblower is the person who reports about violations of his/ her superior to the superior of that bad superior or to the special institution that is supposed to oversee the cases of violations. Everything including blowers is supposed under control and in perfect order. Otherwise you can imagine how much noise will be around from all these “whistles” and “blows” 🙂
I know little about Stepanov and his wife. Their life story and motivations. I don’t believe that people like Rodchenkov can be called a whistleblower by anybody’s definition – yours, mine or asf’s ( if he has such).

Craig Lord

No, quite so, Yozhik, Rodchenko belongs to a different definition … though aspects of what he is now doing fit the bill: “The term whistle-blower comes from the whistle a referee uses to indicate an illegal or foul play. US civic activist Ralph Nader is said to have coined the phrase, but he in fact put a positive spin on the term in the early 1970s to avoid the negative connotations found in other words such as ‘informers’ and snitches’.” And this application in the UK – related to the National health Service:

The Freedom to Speak Up Review set out 20 principles to bring about improvements to help whistleblowers in the NHS, including:

Culture of raising concerns – to make raising issues a part of normal routine business of any well-led NHS organization.
Culture free from bullying – freedom of staff to speak out relies on staff being able to work in a culture which is free from bullying.
Training – every member of staff should receive training in their trust’s approach to raising concerns and in receiving and acting on them.
Support – all NHS trusts should ensure there is a dedicated person to whom concerns can be easily reported and without formality, a “speak up guardian” .
Support to find alternative employment in the NHS – where a worker who has raised a concern cannot, as a result, continue their role, the NHS should help them seek an alternative job.

Many of the things inherent in that culture are not replicated in the world of elite sport.

aswimfan

Yozhik,
CL’s answer on definitions of whistleblower would also be my answer. Here’s another example of recent Russian whistleblower with respect to systematic doping:
Darya Pishchalnikova
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/06/16/sports/olympics/world-anti-doping-agency-russia-cheating.html?_r=1

aswimfan

When I was writing about whistleblower in Russia in my original comment, I had in mind Darya Pishchalnikova

Yozhik

Craig (is it ok to address you such informally 🙂 ), believe you or not I am with you on that and am on the same page. Some people say that should Snowden report to let say to FBI but not to Guardian then he would be a good guy. But you know what, there were people before him who did exactly such thing. Nobody heard those whistles. I am not intending to continue this political discussion on swimming site because I’m in no way an expert in this area.
I asked asf about his definition to help him to answer the question if there were cases of whistleblowing in the Soviet Union. His talks about this country are practically the same should I talk about Sukarno and Suharto’s regimes having only informations from Soviet news agencies.

aswimfan

Yozhik,
You are very much welcome to talk about Sukarno and Suharto’s regime when the discussion topic relates. I definitely will NOT tell you to “shut up” “because you know nothing about Suharto and Sukarno”.
If you make mistake based on incorrect information, I will try to give you the correct answer.
But I will NEVER tell you to leave it alone.
Telling someone to shut up because they know nothing sounds very totalitarian to me, pretty much like a Soviet-era attitude I’ve heard so much about 🙂

aswimfan

So, Yozhik, since I was very wrong in my original post about sports whistleblower during Soviet era, would you be so kind to tell us some of Soviet whistleblowers who told international sports federation that Soviet athletes were doping?
It would be very enlighting.

Craig Lord

Craig is my name, Yozhik – very relaxed about it, too 🙂

Yozhik

@asf: I don’t know what you heard about Soviet Uninon and who was the source of information, but based on what you are saying you indeed know very little. Regarding your question about sport whistleblowers in the Soviet Uninon. In terms of reporting problem bypassing immediate supervisors you can find plenty of cases. Many of them had a form with negative connotation mentioned by Craig above. Another popular form was writing letters to the Central Committee of Communist Party. Sometimes it worked. Contacting someone abroad without permission was the political act regardless the topic and the consequences could be serious. No different than the case with Snowden.
If you want to know how it was felt inside this system then read beachmouse’s comment. It was less like totalitarian but more like very bureaucratic system that was open for corruption bribery and many other similar things. You can find it everywhere in the world. The problem with this system in the Soviet Union was that it was protected with ideological wrapper. The higher the post of bureaucrat was the more highly ideological words were used to cover wrong doing. If you think that there were no other people in this country than bureaucrats then you are mistaken.
I think I enlightened you enough with the information that nobody else is interested in. It will conclude this discussion.

aswimfan

Yozhik,
That was I meant in the first place when I mentioned whistleblower with Darya Pishchalnikova in mind.

I could not imagine during Soviet Union that someone from the inside would have written letter to IAAF or IOC telling that Soviet athletes were doping.

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